How Bob Lesser‘s Peak Performance Formula Can Turn You Into a Peak Performer
Bob Lesser, Author, Coach, Psychotherapist on His Peak Performance Formula and How it Can Help You Become a Peak Performer
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Bob Lesser is a founder, psychotherapist, and executive coach. From 2010-2017 Bob founded and led Mott Hall Charter School, an innovative public school serving low-income students in the South Bronx section of New York City. The school combined rigorous academics with cutting-edge social and emotional health supports enabling its students to defy the odds and attend top, college-bound high schools in New York and beyond. During that time Bob managed a rapidly growing organization that tripled in size over three years. Bob is also a trained psychotherapist and executive coach working primarily with start-up founders in the San Francisco Bay Area, New York City, Boston, Canada, and elsewhere. He studied management, negotiation, and leadership at Harvard’s Kennedy School of Government where he holds a Master’s Degree and obtained his BA in sociology from Vassar College. Bob lived in Vietnam where he studied meditation and Buddhism. He lives in Oakland, California with his wife and three children.
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Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Bob Lesser: The purpose helps us clarify what really matters. And it points us to what we should be using our skills and talents for. It gives us courage to act in conditions of uncertainty and difficulty, and it functions as both. This kind of it’s sort of a grounding for us, but it also helps us move forward. So it’s kind of like our north star.
[00:00:25] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Hello, and welcome to the innovative mindset podcast. I’m your host Izolda Trakhtenberg. On the show, I interview peak performing innovators in the creative social impact and earth conservation spaces or working to change the world. This episode is brought to you by brain FM brain FM combines the best of music and neuroscience to help you.
[00:00:43] Focus meditate and even sleep. I love it and have been using it to write, create and do some of my deepest work because you’re a listener of the show. You can get a free trial head over to brain.fm/innovative mindset. To check it out. If you decide to subscribe, you can get 20% [00:01:00] off with the coupon code, innovative mindset.
[00:01:03] And now let’s get to the show.
[00:01:09] Hey there. And welcome to the innovative mindset podcast. My name is Izolda Trakhtenberg. I’m your host. I’m super happy that you’re here and I’m really excited to speak to this week’s guest. You have got to hear this. This is so cool. Bob lesser is a founder psychotherapist and executive coach. From 2010 to 2017,
[00:01:28] bob founded and led. Mott hall, charter school an innovative public school, serving low income students in the south Bronx section of New York city. And you know how much that is close to my heart since I’m a new Yorker. Now the school combined rigorous academics with cutting edge, social and emotional health supports, enabling its students to defy the odds and attend top college bound high schools in New York and beyond.
[00:01:50] Yes, I’m all about education. So this is thrilling for me. During that time, Bob managed a rapidly growing organization that tripled in size over three years. [00:02:00] He’s also a trained psychotherapist and executive coach working primarily with startup founders in the San Francisco bay area, New York city, Boston, Canada, and all sorts of other places.
[00:02:10] He said he management negotiation and leadership at Harvard’s Kennedy school of government, where he holds a master’s degree and obtained his BA in sociology. From foster college, Bob lived in Vietnam. Wow. Where he studied meditation and Buddhism also. Wow. He lives in Oakland, California with his wife and three children.
[00:02:27] Bob, thank you so much for being on the show. Welcome
[00:02:29] Bob Lesser: pleasure. Or that, that guy that you just introduced. Sounds really interesting. I’d love to hang out, hang out with them.
[00:02:35] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Let’s go have a cup of coffee,
[00:02:36] Bob Lesser: hard to, hard, to hard to believe, but that’s me. My hair at all.
[00:02:41] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Yeah. I, you know, all at once it can sometimes be a little like really.
[00:02:45] Okay. I guess that yes, I did that step into that power. Right. So I I’m, I am excited beyond. Imagining talking to you about everything that you’ve done. I’m a huge proponent of education. I was a NASA master [00:03:00] trainer working in schools all over the world for many years. And I, I want, I’m dying to find out from you how you combined.
[00:03:09] The flow of I’m going to start an innovative public school working with low-income students to being an executive coach for fortune 500 companies. Where, how did that start and what led you down that path?
[00:03:24] Bob Lesser: Yeah, it’s a, it’s a great question. And I think it’s, it’s kind of the crux of it is, has to do with purpose and has to do with.
[00:03:33] Identifying sort of the essence of who I am and the impact that I want to have. And so, you know, like most of us, you know, young getting out of college, you know, trying to figure out what I wanted to do with the rest of my life, or at least, you know, the next few years of my life. Following following my passions, I’m a native new Yorker.
[00:03:52] I came back to New York city and, and participated in a very cool fellowship in New York city government called the New York city urban fellows [00:04:00] program and worked in city government for the first, the first part of my career first at the New York city correction department. And then for the New York city police department and ultimately from the New York city department of education.
[00:04:12] Where I worked with aspiring school leaders who were founding schools, founding new schools, founding charter schools. And we’re creating these innovative new school models. And I got into my, into my head that I could do it just as well or better than the folks that I was I was working with and supporting.
[00:04:31] And so I pulled together a team and we wrote up a charter application and. We got approved and we opened a school and that school was my hall charter school, which, which coincidentally is, is celebrating its 10 year anniversary this year. And yeah, and so so I did that and I did it and it was really hard.
[00:04:51] It was, it was, it was harder than I ever thought it would be. And it really kicked me out. And while I think I did a great job, I also know that [00:05:00] I was quite exhausted by, you know, the, the fourth year, the fifth year. And I was kind of running out of gas and I knew I needed to hand it over to somebody who had, you know, sort of like hand the Baton to somebody who had more energy and, and, and, and, and, and, and endurance and more passionate about.
[00:05:17] Than I had. And, you know, I found a great successor and transferred, you know, transition the leadership of the school over to her, and she’s still there and doing an amazing job. And when I was really soul searching about, well, what, what, you know, what’s next for me? And what about this experience is you know, was essential.
[00:05:36] What I determined was that it was, it was that process of start. Creating something from nothing. That was what my passion was and, and what kind of, what my sort of deeper purpose was, was that sort of create that, that, that component of creativity, you know, taking an idea and making the reality and doing the heavy lifting of getting it up and running.
[00:05:57] And so that’s how I transitioned over then to working [00:06:00] with with founders as an executive coach. And working primarily now with founders of startups mostly in the, in the tech startup space, because that’s, you know, that’s obviously, that’s sort of where the, the sort of the, the, the startup ecosystem is still working with some education leaders and organizations.
[00:06:17] But primarily we’re working with some of the kind of best and brightest minds in Silicon valley helping to, you know, get these amazing ideas that they have for changing the world off the ground.
[00:06:30] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Yea, all of that. I I’m going gonna, I want to take a second and, and sort of so-called have that in because every word that you just said was music to my ears.
[00:06:40] And first of all, kudos to you for realizing when your work with the school was done and passing the Baton. I think that’s, that’s very self-aware and, and I’m grateful that you. That you did that because it allowed you to go to this next place. And you said, you’re going to, you’re you’re moving into, or you’ve moved [00:07:00] into working with tech startups who want to change the world, which again, music to my ears.
[00:07:04] And yet I can’t help thinking that there, that that word that you used early on purpose is really a part of. The sort of the foundation of what you do. And it seems like it was that way with students and it seems like it could be. And is that way with the founders that you’re working with in Silicon valley?
[00:07:24] Can you talk a little bit more about what you mean by purpose? Is that an internal purpose or is it the purpose of the startup or what you want for other people to experience? How does all of that flow and what do you bring to it? And.
[00:07:40] Bob Lesser: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. It start, it starts off as a very individual thing is, is what is my purpose?
[00:07:45] What’s my why. And the way I, I define it is it’s really the expression of what’s most deeply meaningful. You can know who you are at your essence. We’ve we all have this sort of deeper level of purpose of, of kind of [00:08:00] who we are at our essence. What’s most deeply meaningful to us. And you know, it, it purpose helps us clarify what really matters and it points us to what we, what we should be using our skills and talents for.
[00:08:14] Right. It gives us, it gives us courage to act in conditions of uncertainty and difficulty, and it functions as both this kind of it’s sort of a grounding for us, but it also helps us move forward. So it’s kind of like our north star. And so knowing, knowing our essence, knowing who we are at our essence and how we want to express that in the world is in my mind, that’s required for anyone that wants to do anything.
[00:08:41] And, you know, starting, starting a company, you know, that it has never been started before in you know building and creating a product that’s never been created before creating anything that’s never been, been done before, or, or even that you’ve never done before is going to be hard. And so having this strong sense of grounded.
[00:08:59] [00:09:00] Of this is part of this is deeply personal and meaningful to me and, and it’s, it’s on purpose for me. So it starts with that and it starts, and that’s often where I start with the founders that I work with is helping them to clarify their purpose and articulate their purpose. Purpose also extends to organizations, organizations need to know why they exist.
[00:09:22] They need to know, you know, kind of who they are at essence and so far. So great organizations have well articulated purpose statements and, and purpose has kind of for many organizations supplanted, the old mission statement, you know, the sort of, you know, we exist to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
[00:09:41] Versus. Our purpose is, this is, this is why we exist. This is our why, this is why we do this work. As one request an organization, this is the impact that we seek to have. And so it’s, it’s very powerful for organizations as well, to know who know who they are, know what impact they’re trying to have [00:10:00] and be able to clearly articulate that for both their employees and their clients or customers or people they serve.
[00:10:07] Izolda Trakhtenberg: And I would imagine. Extending that to the community, the organization is in that, that, that, that knowledge of purpose serves a bigger ecosystem than just the organization or the company. Can you talk a little bit about. If, if there is, because one of the things that I do when I work with people and companies and organizations, we talk a lot about compassion.
[00:10:32] That’s that’s in intwined with purpose and compassion to me means that you’re not just thinking about yourself or your organization. You’re thinking about how you. Everyone in that ecosystem for you, when you work with a founder who has this vision to make these changes, how much of the extended family, if you will, are you focusing on or is it first an internal process and then maybe someday they’ll get to that other place.[00:11:00]
[00:11:00] Bob Lesser: Yeah, that’s a great question. I, I, I would say that. The vast majority of ones, you know, sort of, if you take sort of everyone, who’s sort of thought about their purpose and has a kind of well articulated sense of, or even a, you know, half halfway, half baked, you know, articulated sense of that purpose.
[00:11:20] It, their purpose has to do with with the community with others. Very rarely is one’s purpose solely focused on. Themselves. Okay. And you know, you’ll see this, you know, sometimes you’ll see this with elite athletes who are sort of, you know, training for themselves training training for, for their own sort of to achieve their own highest potential.
[00:11:39] But very often you’ll hear them talk about how they want to be an inspiration or a role model for others. They want to show they want to show that, you know, someone from this city or this town or, or, or this, you know, th this background. Can make it and so, so very, very often I’d say more often than not, there is a component that [00:12:00] involves being of service to inspiring helping others in, in one’s purpose.
[00:12:07] Izolda Trakhtenberg: I’m taking all of that in for a second because I, it, the Olympics just happened and we just had all of these people when all of these metals and so many of them. When they were talking about having one we’re talking about, you know, winning it for the team or for their country, it’s always something that is, that is greater than themselves.
[00:12:29] And when you do the work you do and. Everything I’ve read about you. Doesn’t say that you were specifically with athletes, you’re working with founders, but it’s still, they’re still trying to be the very best. And so I know we’re going to talk a little bit about the book that you’ve written, which I’m excited to delve into, but the big thing, I there’s something about the words.
[00:12:51] Cause I talk about this also peak. That just inspires me. It’s also, like you said, it’s [00:13:00] grounding, but also it lets you fly a little bit because it means that you’ve, that you’ve got this vision that you want to achieve someday. Can you talk a little bit about what it means to be a peak performer, physically, mentally, professionally?
[00:13:12] What does peak performer mean to you? That you are spending so much of your life and your work studying it and working.
[00:13:20] Bob Lesser: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. My definition of peak performer is, is maybe a little different than, you know, some of the others are some, some, you know, what, what sort of, how it’s talked about in the field.
[00:13:30] I defined peak performer as, as being your best, not being the best necessarily, but being your best, really living up to your potential. And it’s, and it sort of has two parts to it. One is it is about achieving results or, or, you know, sort of meeting your goals, but it’s also about 50. And being, being, and feeling fulfilled.
[00:13:54] And I, I, you know, I kind of believe that one without the other ultimately is kind of [00:14:00] flimsy and on some level is empty. So just achieving you know, without a sense of fulfillment, still feeling like you’re not enough or still feeling like you haven’t really done what you’ve been put on earth to do is, is not going to be that satisfying being just fulfilled and sort of feeling great and, you know, You know, feel happy and I’m hanging out on the beach here and, you know without achieving your goals, the things that, you know, you know, you are capable of or you believe you’re capable of, or you’re, you wonder if you’re capable of is also going to ultimately feel this, you know, maybe hedonistic and, you know, at the end of the day, Kind of get boring.
[00:14:35] So it’s, it’s both of those things. It’s achieving your goals that you set for yourself feeling feeling you know, kind of optimal fulfillment and being, being the best that you can be being your best. And that’s how I think about peak performance. And I think most, if not everyone wants that.
[00:14:56] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Sorry, I’m taking all that in that last sentence made me go. Hmm. [00:15:00] I wonder if they do I do, because, because there are lots of people, you know, I’ve heard, I’ve heard therapists say this before that in any moment whoever’s doing the, they might be doing the most awful thing, but they are doing the very best they can in that moment.
[00:15:14] And so, so that, so that I get, but at the same time, I wonder sometimes. How, how do you know if you’re being a peak performer is somebody who’s spending their life on the couch, watching jeopardy and eating Cheetos. Being a peak performer, if that’s what they want to do, like if their goal is I’m just going to chill through my life all as well.
[00:15:39] Is that them being a, be a peak performer or is that them being a little lackadaisical about the goals they might have?
[00:15:47] Bob Lesser: Yeah, it’s a, it’s a kind of a slippery question because if it is truly that person’s goal. And if, if I sort of, before I get into [00:16:00] goals, I talk about vision and vision for me is one of the, is one of the peak performance pillars.
[00:16:06] There are three peak performance pillars. There’s purpose, there’s values, and there’s vision. Vision is about where we want to. And in our life, it’s, it’s the, it’s the destination. And the more clear we can be about that, the more, more able we are to design our lives and our actions and behaviors to get there.
[00:16:28] So if that is really, truly Aligned with an in support of one’s vision, if, you know, hanging out, you know, sort of on a couch and, you know, eating, what are they eating? Doritos
[00:16:40] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Cheetos.
[00:16:43] Bob Lesser: Yeah. Well, if you know, if they’re snacking and that, and they’re doing that, you know, you know, for, you know, large parts of the day, and that is, is somehow aligned with their ultimate vision, then yes, I would say, and they’re feeling fulfilled and they’re achieving then.
[00:16:56] Yes, I would say they are, they are being a peak performer under [00:17:00] my definition. However I would say we, there, there, and this, this is, this is what I, I, I termed the performance paradox. There are a number of ways in which we work against ourselves from really getting what we want, achieving what we want and feeling fulfilled.
[00:17:20] And we can, in some ways, fool ourselves or talk ourselves out. Doing the things that will actually get us what we want or even, or even really being honest about what we want. And so there, there are ways that we’re, it’s, it’s, it’s, we’re, we’re kind of built in and I have sort of five major ways that I think about this.
[00:17:43] We’re kind of built to kind of work against ourselves and work against our achievement of what it is we really want.
[00:17:51] Izolda Trakhtenberg: I that’s there. Believe it or not. This reminds me of a Terminator movie. I am a huge that my, a friend of mine coined the [00:18:00] term cinephile nose tele parable. That’s what it is. I am a cinephile, but he quoted, he, he coined the term tele parable because I use movie quotes.
[00:18:08] To give lessons a lot. And there’s a moment in which Arnold Schwarzenegger’s Terminator says, you know, you humans, it is in your nature to destroy yourselves. And what you said kind of sparked that for me, because I I’m sitting here and I’m going, is that part of it? Is it, is, is it that, or is it fear?
[00:18:27] Like what keeps us from acting in our own best interests in, in that.
[00:18:34] Bob Lesser: Yeah. Yeah, I love it. I don’t think it’s, it’s this sort of death wish that, you know, sort of Suman Freud talked about early on in his, in his, in his theory. I think it’s actually more maladaptive mal adaptive survival mechanisms that have not evolved with us in our, in our modern world and our sort of vestiges of, you know, sort of the old.
[00:18:58] When we were, you know, [00:19:00] evading the, the saber tooth tiger. And when we had predators and when we were, when we were really you know, it was all about survival and, and, and our lives were literally in danger. You know and, you know, for most of us, that’s not the case anymore, but our minds and our nervous systems have really not evolved to kind of to meet, meet the demands of the modern world.
[00:19:22] And I think, I think it’s mostly, I think it’s, it’s more of that. And if, if you want, I can, I can also, you know, kind of quickly go over these sort of five things that I think sort of stand in our way of really really, you know, sort of being a peak performer, achieving what. The stage
[00:19:38] Izolda Trakhtenberg: is yours.
[00:19:38] Absolutely. I’d love to hear them. Are you
[00:19:40] Bob Lesser: kidding? All right. Wonderful. So the first, the first one is the unconscious mind. This is our unconscious mind. This is where, you know, 95% of the action is happening in our mind is unconsciously out of, out of conscious awareness. We, we don’t know it at times. It, it sort of peaks up and become semi-conscious and we have [00:20:00] some, some idea of it, but mostly it’s happening out of our conscious awareness.
[00:20:03] These are our organizing patterns. This is where our, our self-limiting beliefs live. You know, it’s, it’s, I’m not good enough. You know, I’m unworthy, I’m unlovable. You know, the world is unfair. That’s where all that stuff lives. It’s where our internal saboteurs live. You know, and this sort of, you know, sneaky, you know, and insidious thing called imposter syndrome that many of us face.
[00:20:25] So that’s where all of that stuff kind of lurks and it lurks again without our awareness and without our consent and, and it’s, but it’s there and it’s sort of running us you know, personality experts believe that our, our personalities are mostly. Defined by the time we’re about five years old in terms of our sort of basic organizing patterns and beliefs about the world.
[00:20:46] So essentially, you know, that means we have a, five-year-old running the show and that’s kind of scary to think about, you know, I know at five, at five years old, I was, you know, I was eating dirt. So, you know, So that’s the first one, [00:21:00] our unconscious mind. The second one is our self-conscious mind. This is to the X, the extent to which we value and probably overvalue other people’s opinions.
[00:21:10] And we are so concerned and worried about what other people will think. How we will look about belonging to the in-group that we it, it, it keeps us from doing things that we want, that we think where we may look dumb, or we may look, you know, we may be rejected. And it also, when we become overly, so self-conscious when we are trying to do, to do, to do something, to perform it impedes performance.
[00:21:35] We we’ve all been there where, you know, once you start sort of, you know, wondering what other people are thinking about, you, you know, you start, you know, it really messes up. Right. So that’s the second one. Self-conscious mind. The third one is, is squarely the sort of biology physiology that I was talking about.
[00:21:50] You know, we’re designed to conserve energy as, as animals, as, you know, as a, as a species like other animals are, we want to conserve energy. [00:22:00] We don’t want to expend energy when we don’t have to. So that is, that is. We may want to sit on the couch and eat Doritos instead of, you know, go out for that run or, you know, do the thing we know that’s going to be really hard.
[00:22:10] And so we need to be able to push through that that energy con conservation, because most things that we want to do in life that are going to be really fulfilling and rewarding are also going to be demanding and challenging, and we’re going to require us to expend some energy. The other part of that is, you know, this is sort of the.
[00:22:30] No human capacity to worry. Have anxiety stress out that animals, you know, don’t have other animals don’t have that we have. And it really makes, keeps our nervous systems kind of on high alert. You know? So there’s this, this, you know, the stress response system is, is sort of is, is, is, is primed to activate you know, when we get cut off in traffic it’s as if the saber tooth tiger is like, is coming to.
[00:22:57] And, and when, you know, when, in fact it’s not. [00:23:00] And so so the, the way that our stress response system is sort of is, is, is, is overactive for, for many people, unless somebody, unless you’ve really trained yourself through meditation and yoga and breathing and, and practices of that, of that nature you are often getting hijacked by your by your amygdala and the stress response.
[00:23:21] System is again, running, running your responses rather than your rational mind. So that’s the third one. The F the fourth one is I call the hedonic treadmill. And this is a psychologist Barry Schwartz talks about, about this in his book that the paradox of choice and this to me, the, so the hedonic treadmill is this notion of how we, our brains are wired to be attracted, to shiny the shiny new object, right?
[00:23:47] Novelty novelty is one of the. That our motivation system works. It’s how we become excited about things is when they’re new and novel. That’s great for getting out in the world and sort of finding food and, you know, you [00:24:00] know, you know, kind of inventing tools that are help us survive. But we also quickly get disinterested in things.
[00:24:07] And we get excited about the next. And we get disinterested in that and we get excited about the next thing, and we get disinterested in that. And that’s this treadmill, hedonic, treadmill metaphor. And what that does is it makes it hard for us to sustain our focus on things that matter. When things start getting feeling a little mundane or boring, we’ve got to put in repetition to do things and to become really good at, we got to, we know we have to put in, you know, we’ve got the 10,000 hour rule.
[00:24:35] It’s it’s, it becomes hard to stay focused and interested in things. Are meaningful to us, but because of the way our brains work become boring. And our minds you know, men in Buddhism, there’s this notion of the monkey mind, the way our minds work, our distracted mind. It’s very hard to focus very hard to kind of keep our minds on one thing.
[00:24:58] And [00:25:00] and to not give into this, this hedonic treadmill of, you know, the next shiny new object that we’re ultimately gonna get. The last one is this the way our minds are wired for negativity. This is something that, you know, neuroscientists have dubbed the negativity bias. We are much more attuned to and amplify negative things.
[00:25:21] Things that are pretend may be potentially harmful to us. Maybe threatening to us than we are to, you know, the good things. So this is, you know, we’re walking through the forest and we’re much more attuned to, you know, that twig that looks like a snake, you know and stepping out of the way of that and looking for, you know, looking for anything that might be dangerous than we are noticing the beautiful flowers that you know, can sort of leave us in.
[00:25:48] And so this, this negativity bias really over it has this, over-index some things that may be dangerous or harmful. It leads to anxiety, risk, aversion and pessimism that [00:26:00] you know, is not so helpful to us in our pursuits. When what we really need is optimism, especially when things are getting checked.
[00:26:08] So those are, those are the five, you know, performance paradoxes that I kind of outlined the ways in which, you know, we are in many ways designed to work against ourselves and what it is we really want.
[00:26:23] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Wow. Wow. Okay. So much, so much. I, I, I appreciate you outlining them and I, a lot of this. First of all, it’s so succinct and I’m really grateful that you have it so well down. I’m excited to talk about the book and and see more about how you detail these things. I have a couple of questions though, about, about these five and about something that you said.
[00:26:52] About the five-year-old the, the, the emperor, the five-year-old emperor of your, of your brain. [00:27:00] When you talk about that. Cause I do want to talk about these five pillars, but there’s this is, this is something that I wonder about children who go through. For example, if, if we’re in that space of child abuse or some other kind of, of trauma of children in war zones, what kind of challenges, extra challenges do those children then have to get past?
[00:27:24] Not just the inner five-year-old, but the trauma that they survived in order to become peak.
[00:27:31] Bob Lesser: Yeah, it’s a great question. I mean, they, they, they certainly are going to have organizing patterns, limiting beliefs about themselves in the world that are going to impact how they behave. The actions they take, the actions, they don’t take the, the, the relationships with others.
[00:27:51] And You know, not to say that it’s going to be, you know, impossible for them. Cause you know, certainly people who have suffered trauma have gone on to [00:28:00] be, you know, perform at the highest selfless to become, you know, to be elite performers. But it’s, it’s, you know, they’re gonna, they’re gonna struggle.
[00:28:08] They’re gonna suffer in the ways that we all do, but maybe more. And you know, so it does, it does go back to this sort of ultimately the question becomes what are their core beliefs about themselves and what are their core beliefs about the world? And You know, how will that enable them or get in the way of their doing the work to get what it is they want in life and to feel fulfilled doing it.
[00:28:34] So that would be the, sort of the big question that I would have, or I would look at with anyone who has suffered a trauma early. Early in life is, you know, are they are they able to do still do the things that are necessary to achieve their goals and, and feel fulfillment? And a lot of that does come down to, you know, their, their perceptions in themselves or perceptions of others, or ability to have re have healthy relationships[00:29:00] their ability to stay the course when things get difficult and be consistent, you know, the consistency required.
[00:29:06] To do anything worthwhile and challenging. So, you know, certainly not not impossible, but you know, it’s, it’s it’s, it’s hard, you know, it’s hard anyway. And especially if you’ve had trauma, hopefully they’ve been able to get support and get help and, you know, be able to, to, to come to terms, you know, with with what happened and maybe use it as.
[00:29:26] You know, I think, I think you see that in a lot of elite performers who have had early hardship is they’ve been able to use it as fuel to help motivate them and to keep them going and to sort of, you know you know, and it’s, it’s, in some ways, you know, built their resilience and their, and their, and their they’re on their toes.
[00:29:43] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Yeah, it’s so interesting that you, that you said that, that, that that’s this notion of using it as fuel because these pillars that you’re talking about, I can see the self-conscious part of that and the sort of the expectation of being cared for as a baby, all of a sudden that’s [00:30:00] not there. Right? So how people think of you and how you think they think of you is, is an unstable foundation.
[00:30:07] So that’s why I was wondering about how someone who has survived trauma. Deal with these five pillars and, and still perform at a peak level. I wonder the other one that I, that sort of was like, Hmm. What about people who have attention deficit issues? How do they deal with those issues to then sort of climb up and become peak performers?
[00:30:34] Bob Lesser: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I mean, hopefully, you know, they have been able to find ways to manage their ADHD. They’ve maybe they’ve found, you know, a meditation practice. Maybe they found medication that has worked for them. Hopefully they’ve chosen endeavors that are well sort of, well-suited to you know, to sort of you know, maybe more distractable.
[00:30:57] And, you know, have maybe gravitate it to something that, you know, [00:31:00] maybe, you know, that’s like sort of like startup entrepreneurs tend to be people who are like interested in a lot of things and you have to be focused on a lot of different things when you’re starting and leading a company. And, and so, you know, hopefully they found pursuits that are.
[00:31:14] You know, sort of you know, not impeded, not overly impeded by, you know, their, their challenges in focusing. And you know, and yeah, it’s, you know, you know, again, you know, I think. These, these couple of questions that you have you know, we’re all, we are all flawed. We are all, you know, challenged, we all suffer.
[00:31:37] So, so it is, it is the human condition and it is about figuring out. How to work within the constraints that we have to meet our highest potential. And we all have constraints, you know, I am never going to be an NBA basketball player because I’m five, seven. Right. So, you know, and I’m never going to be an astronaut because I’m too old [00:32:00] right now.
[00:32:00] So these are real constraints. So when we talk about one’s potential, we’re not talking about, you know The sort of, you know sort of potential without constraints. And I think that’s important is for us all to understand who we are, what the constraints are that are, are kind of, you know, sort of you know, that we’re, we’re working with.
[00:32:19] And so the question becomes, how do we maximize ourselves, given the constraints that we face, given who we are. And, and, and not, you know, deny those things or not be ashamed of those things, but to really know, like, this is a constraint I have, so I got, I have to work with, you know, I have to work with it.
[00:32:37] Izolda Trakhtenberg: And that goes back right to the very first thing you said, which was, it’s not about being the best, it’s about being your best. Right. And, and I, I love that. And it ties beautifully into this idea of, of what you said about vision values and purpose that having that amalgam and then being able to work through.
[00:32:58] And with it allows you to get to [00:33:00] that place, which dovetails beautifully into talking about the peak performance formula, your book. I would love it. If you would talk a little bit about, let me, let me just give the whole title because I love it. I think it’s so wonderful. The peak performance formula, achieving breakthrough results in life and work.
[00:33:17] Yes. You’re again, you’re singing my song, Bob. So I would love to hear from you a little bit about. First of all, what prompted you to write it? And second of all, what is it that you want the book to do for the people who read it?
[00:33:34] Bob Lesser: Yes. Well, what prompted me to write it was really, you know, I, you know, work with my clients is an executive coach.
[00:33:42] And prior to that, as a psychotherapist and, you know, do this really. Intentional work that you know, yields great results helps people to be their best and developing tools and techniques throughout the years that have been really effective in helping people deal [00:34:00] with the. Unique, but not but unique, but also somewhat universal challenges that that, you know, these, these founders and executives and leaders you know, we’re facing and.
[00:34:13] I wrote the book because I wanted to make it accessible to a larger audience, not just, you know you know, the, the, the you know, the, the tech, startup CEO, or though, you know, leader of the big organization you know, that I’m working with to my executive coaching practice, but I want to make it accessible to really anyone, anyone who’s trying to get better at anything, whether that’s, you know, a student who’s trying to get their grades up in school, you know, The new college grad, that’s trying to figure out how to, you know, kind of, you know what to do with, with, you know, the sort of next phase of their lives.
[00:34:43] A manager in a company who is trying to move up somebody who’s thinking about starting their own company you know, really anyone who’s like, you know, I need some tools and tactics to to, to. Achieve the things that I, that I want to achieve. And I, and I want to do it in a way that [00:35:00] is about me, what matters to me and will bring me fulfillment, not what society says or thinks I should do.
[00:35:06] So, so that that’s, that’s why. To sort of make it, make it try and make that more accessible. And the set was the second part of the
[00:35:15] Izolda Trakhtenberg: question. What is it that you want readers of the book to get out of it? Like what, what is, what is your desire for someone picks up the book reads it? What do you want them to have that they didn’t have before they picked up the book?
[00:35:31] Bob Lesser: Yeah, I, I think it’s, it’s a sort of tools and tactics to, to allow each individual reader to become a peak performer in their, in their own lives. And, and, and, you know, make the kind of you know, breakthrough achievements that maybe have. Holding the things that have been holding them back or or things that they’ve been, you know, really wanting to do, but just, you know, you haven’t had the tools to do that to really provide those, [00:36:00] those sort of tangible tools and tactics to allow people give people some tools to really know themselves, better understand themselves better.
[00:36:07] There’s a lot of that in the book of, you know, helping them, giving them guided exercises to. Define what their purpose is to articulate their core guiding values, to to articulate their vision from, for themselves and where they want to go in their lives. So, so, so that sort of self knowledge, then those tools and tactics to, you know, to be one’s best to, you know, transform, you know, the imposter syndrome, if that’s something that they face to.
[00:36:39] Con be able to come to see failure as, you know, not somebody to be scared of, but actually something to embrace to, you know, really make sure that they are doing the sort of baseline things that we know will help anyone trying to do to do anything important in their lives around physical health and energy [00:37:00] management training one’s mind.
[00:37:02] To again, overcome some of these performance paradoxes that we talked about in the beginning and to sort of master the techniques that they need to master in whatever endeavor it is that they’re that they’re pursuing and to, to, to, you know, use tried and true tools and tactics to do that.
[00:37:20] Izolda Trakhtenberg: You keep stopping me. I kind of go, ah, I need to take all this in because there’s so much there’s so, so much rich stuff in, in, in what you’re saying, something that I’m really curious about with, within that. I love that it’s tactical. I love books that, that don’t just go, let me just strategize for you.
[00:37:39] And then you go and try and do it all by yourself. So I’m so glad that that’s, that that’s in the book. Something that I. That I’m wondering about is when, like you’ve said this a couple of times already, not in these words, but that we have a tendency toward entropy that we kind of don’t [00:38:00] work at our best within the book.
[00:38:04] What are the steps? Someone who has that tendency to sit on the couch and eat Cheetos and then dream about doing more. What’s the first step? What do they do for.
[00:38:16] Bob Lesser: That’s a good question. I mean, I, I start, the book starts with. Because I think, I think purpose is this really, this sort of motivator, the purpose gives us motivation, the stronger our purposes.
[00:38:28] The more motivated we will be, the more motivated we are, the more energy we will direct to do something. It’ll get us off the couch, the stronger our purposes. And, you know, you hear these stories about, you know, parents were able to lift heavy cars up, you know, you know, to save their children, you know, this sort of the strength.
[00:38:46] It, that comes from purpose, the motivation, the energy that comes from purpose. So I like to start there because that is a sort of an Energizer. And then, you know, I, I do think [00:39:00] You know, vision coming, you know, really helping people sort of co if they, if they don’t have that strong vision from themselves.
[00:39:06] Cause that’s that you know, Lewis, Carroll, the author said, you know, if you don’t know where you’re going, any road, any road will do. And, and so, you know, we need to know where we’re going, where we want to go. And once we know that once we have a, a as clear a picture of where we want to go, what we want in life as we can, then we can start to set some goals around it that are based on you know, this, this, this real, you know sit this real sense of like, wow, if I could, you know, if I could just make it.
[00:39:37] You know, how great would that be? And so, so then, you know, so you’ve got the, you’ve got purpose, you’ve got vision and then values are the beliefs that drive our behaviors. And so once we begin to, you know, we, we know who we are, what’s deeply meaningful to us or energized around that. Our purpose, we have our vision, which is telling us, you know, Hey, this is kind of, this is where I want to [00:40:00] go.
[00:40:00] I’ve got some now some concrete goals that are gonna are gonna make sure that. I’m getting there, then our values become about what are the behaviors that are going to, if I do those things day in, day out, I practice those behaviors day in, day out. They’re gonna, they are gonna you know, kind of like the oars of you know, of a, of a canoe.
[00:40:20] They’re going to row me in that, in that right direction. They’re going to be the thing, that sort of guy that keeps me moving in that right direction through these, through. Practice of these core values. So that’s how the kind of the peak performance formula works in practice. So purpose, vision values.
[00:40:39] Come together to give us this really strong foundation. And then, and that’s the first part of the book. And then the second part of the book is about these sort of tools and tactics. And these are these things, you know, you know, I break down into sort of three categories, you know, physical, the physical.
[00:40:54] The second is that is, is, is the ticket. And the third is, is, is the mind [00:41:00] training the mind? So the physical is, is stuff that we, most of us know about. But we need to be reminded about, about the optimal amount of sleep to get that kind of diets. We should be eating the ways we should be moving our body and the amount of exercise we should be getting the ways we should really be managing our energy to optimize that energy for the things that are important.
[00:41:20] That the technique piece is giving people some, some tools through a method called deliberate practice. Your PR you probably need to get better at you’re at some technique. So if you know, part of my goal or vision is maybe to, you know, play competitive tennis I’m going to need to work on aspects of my game.
[00:41:38] I’m going to need to, you know, practice my, you know, my serve or my overhead, or, you know, whatever shot needs improving or shots need improving. So I, I need to I need to design some deliberate practice in order to actually get better. At the, at my craft. And so, so that section of the book really addresses some best [00:42:00] practices and how to improve your technique and whatever it is you’re trying to improve.
[00:42:04] The third, third piece of this is, is training the mind. And this, this, again goes back to a lot of the performance products stuff that gets in our way. And this is through, you know, through things like meditation. Practice, you know, I’m a big proponent of, of meditation because of the, you know, the, the incredible benefits that it has and the scientific data that is now available, that backs up the benefits of meditation in terms of, of, you know, what it can do for our nervous system, our immune system how it can help us focus and constant.
[00:42:35] Better. And so it’s really this mental training. That’s important in order to kind of, and, you know, and, and to overcome the negativity bias, to be able to practice optimism and learn to I learned optimism. So things of that nature tools of that nature that are gonna help us to have some control over our minds to, you know, kind of make sure that we’re able to stay on the [00:43:00] path of, of, of our, of our vision.
[00:43:06] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Again, I’m thinking I want to take all of that in. Ah, wow. So it’s, I mean, yay. This is so exciting and it’s, it takes me back to something. That I’m that a lot of times when I work with my own clients, we talk about the, the foundation, which is you have to remind yourself that you deserve to be here. You know, that, that that’s so much of it.
[00:43:32] And as a meditator, I that’s, that’s part of my daily meditation. Right. So when I’m, and I’m gonna use myself as, as the The research tool, I guess when I’m meditating, when I’m in that space. And if I’m trying to do my vision and purpose and values, and I’m trying to get to a place where I feel like I can act on the things that you’re talking about, the tactics, the actual step-by-step stuff [00:44:00] that you detail in the book, how do I remain consistent?
[00:44:06] What does someone need to do? If, if for example, they’re not having results yet, or, or it’s taking a long time or things are moving slower than they might want or need. How do you maintain a consistent level of the practices that, that you outline in the book? If you are someone who’s, who doesn’t have Bob lesser as a coach to sort of talk through it.
[00:44:30] So you’re the you’re, you know, Jane Schmoe and you are. Trying to work through and develop these, this, the values, the vision and the purpose.
[00:44:41] Bob Lesser: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That’s it. It’s a good question. There’s a couple things. So one of the things I talk about in the book is an as again of practice practices of high-performers one of them is to build.
[00:44:52] Around you that will support you. And, you know, the team is going to look a little different depending on, you know, what it is you are trying to achieve and get [00:45:00] better at and and, and optimize. So, but we all need, we all need a team. We all need a support. We all need support. Nobody does it alone. That team part of that, part of what that team does is hold you account.
[00:45:10] As well as support you. And, and so having a team in place that will help you to stay on track, stay on the path that when things aren’t working, we’ll brainstorm with you, what’s not working, what do we need to do differently? And and, and so, so thinking about yourself, just like athletes, do athletes have their, you know, tennis players have their teams of, you know, Their coach, their physiotherapists, their acupuncturist, their dietician they’re right there.
[00:45:36] You know, their fitness coach. They’ve got all these people that are specialized to help them be the best tennis players they can be. Right. What I’m suggesting is that we all need that in our lives. We need our own sort of personal teams that will help us be. You know, w person that we can be the best, you know, whatever it is, you know, fill in the blank that we want to be.
[00:45:58] So part of it is, is, is [00:46:00] really formulating that team and, and, and using that team. And then the other piece is at the very end of the book, I include a 30 day peak performance challenge which walks the reader through how to implement the concepts in the book over a 30 day period on anything that they want.
[00:46:17] They want to get better at anything they want to make sort of breakthrough performance in and what that does. And the reason I included that is because it’s both showing people how tangibly and practically to implement these concepts and day-to-day life. And it also helps to make it. Doing this over 30 days is gonna, is gonna start to build these practices as habits.
[00:46:42] And, you know, it is checking in on purpose, going back to purpose. It is checking in on your values and make sure you’re doing those behaviors. It is checking in with your vision. And, and it is also making sure. The goals that you have said are are the right goals and that you are monitoring and measuring them.
[00:46:59] And so I [00:47:00] include a process that’s taken, actually taken from Google and w what Google uses to manage its its own performance. Called objectives and key results. And I’ve adapted that to personal use so that you are basically setting goals for yourself. And then you’re breaking those goals down into, into monthly objectives and key and key results that are kind of the measurable indicators that tell you the, what progress you’re making towards achieving those objectives.
[00:47:32] And you score yourself. On them and, and it’s as great tool for staying. Seeing where you’re where you’re not on track, where you’re maybe behind and where you need to pick up the pace on things. So that’s a, that’s a very concrete tool that I offer and I use myself that I’ve been doing for years that really has helped me stay consistent.
[00:47:53] Because every week I’m looking at my goals, my objectives for the month that are based on my goals for the year that are based on. [00:48:00] Long-term vision for myself. And I score them and I say, yeah, you’re doing, you know, you’re on track this week or, Hey, you’re, you’re behind schedule and you have to pick up the pace.
[00:48:09] And I used that process to, you know, to kind of, you know, stay, stay on, you know, on track, you know, month by month till I hit six months. And I revisit my annual. To make sure that it’s still relevant and see if anything has changed or if I want to make any modifications. And then I keep going and hopefully by the end of the year, I’m a step closer to achieving my vision.
[00:48:33] Izolda Trakhtenberg: I love that. I love that. That’s again, to me, consistency is so important because you can have the absolute best intentions, but, but if you’re not consistent with it, then. Then you’re going to have a lot of extra challenges, I think. Yeah.
[00:48:49] Bob Lesser: I, and I, and I actually just won one saying that I really love is that elite performers are not consistently great.
[00:48:57] They’re great at being consistent. And [00:49:00] so. Consistency showing up day in, day out is, is the name of the game. And so I’m glad you brought that up because that, that is, you know, it’s not about these heroic performances or, you know you know, going, you know, all 110% all the time. It’s about showing. You know, doing our best day in day out and being consistent and by being consistent is going to be how we become better and ultimately great at something
[00:49:31] Izolda Trakhtenberg: 10,000 hours.
[00:49:32] Yes, absolutely. And that’s, that’s the epitome of consistency. You have to do it for 10,000 hours on Malcolm Gladwell. We love him and we hate him at the same time. Bob, I’m so grateful that you. Took the time to chat with me about your work and the book. I’m super, super excited about it. I would love it if you wouldn’t mind.
[00:49:53] Cause I’m sure, you know, someone’s listening to this going, I need this book. I need to know more about [00:50:00] Bob Lester and the work he’s doing. How does someone connect with you? What, where are the places that someone could find you and also where can the book be found?
[00:50:09] Bob Lesser: Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. I mean, you know, I’m on social media.
[00:50:12] You can find me on Instagram at, at Bob underscore lesser. I’m also on Twitter at lesser underscore bomb. So you can find me both of those places. And you can also go to my website to learn a little bit more about me and my work and. Read some, some articles that I, you know, kinda my new, my new stuff.
[00:50:31] And that’s www.boblesser.com. The book can be ordered it’s out and can be ordered on Amazon Barnes and noble bookshop and indie bound. So, you know, any anywhere, you know, where you prefer to, to, to buy books, those are all the online sources. And the name of the book is the peak performance formula achieving breakthrough results in life.
[00:50:53] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Fabulous. And I’ll put the links to everything in the show notes so that we don’t have to be typing furiously down [00:51:00] everything. So writing it all, noting it all down. Whenever somebody says to me, you know, oh, can you spell that for my name? For example, I’m always like, oh, you don’t want to do that. Let me just send it to you either that, or I say write small because my name is very long.
[00:51:14] Once again, Bob, I’m so grateful that you took the time to be here. I have just one last question that I. Everybody who comes on the show. And it’s a silly question, but I find that it yields some profound results. And the question is this. If you had an airplane that could sky write anything for the whole world to see, what would you say?
[00:51:41] NEF said. All right. Well, that’s, that’s about the most succinct I’ve had there. That’s yeah. Three, three words. That’s good. Cause you can’t, you can’t. Too many words. So there you go, Bob. Thank you once again for being here. I really appreciate it.
[00:51:59] Bob Lesser: Although my pleasure. [00:52:00] Thanks for having me.
[00:52:01] Izolda Trakhtenberg: Wow. So you have gotten it from Bob lesser.
[00:52:04] You’re going to need to go out and get the peak performance formula. Be consistent in your practices. Figure out your vision, your purpose, your values, and live your best life and do your best work. It’s really the way it’s all about. I am. Izolda Trakhtenberg for the innovative mindset podcast. And I’m hoping that you enjoyed the show.
[00:52:24] I’m hoping that you are enjoying your day, and I’m hoping that if you do like what you’re hearing. Drop a review, tell a friend about this episode so that more people can learn about Bob and the incredible work he’s doing to help people be peak performers until next time, remember to listen, learn, laugh, and love a whole lot.
[00:52:49] thanks so much for joining me today. I really appreciate you being here. Please subscribe to the podcast if you’re new and if you like what you’re hearing, please review it and rate it and let other people. [00:53:00] And if you’d like to be a sponsor of the show, I’d love to meet you on patrion.com/innovative mindset.
[00:53:06] I also have lots of exclusive goodies to share just with the show supporters there today’s episode was produced by Izolda Trakhtenberg and his copyright 2020. As always, please remember, this is for educational and entertainment purposes. Only past performance does not guarantee future results, although we can always hope until next time, keep living in your innovative mindset.